Creating a clear understanding of your target market is crucial for effective marketing. To find prospects, marketers segment by demographics, geography, age, and other factors. But taking time to craft a profile of the personality traits of your ideal client allows you to hyper-focus those marketing efforts.
On this Elementality, Abby and Grant Botma of Stewardship Financial look at the benefits of creating an “ideal client avatar”. First, analyze the attributes of your “best” clients—you’re familiar with how they accept advice and how your offerings address their problems. Then use those qualities to develop an avatar, which allows your firm to concentrate your strategies on maximizing the number of ideal clients who are attracted to your firm.
Podcast Transcript
Grant Botma:
When you do an ideal customer avatar or ideal customer profile, kind of workshopping, and have that for your business, it gives you a target. It helps you understand not only the types of marketing that you may want to engage in to attract more of those ideal customers, but it also helps you engineer customer journeys that those ideal customers will appreciate, and allows you to earn more referrals that are like those particular ideal customers. It gives you a target, it gives you something to aim at, and then as a result, it gives so many important pieces of your business something to aim at as well.
Jordan Haines:
Welcome to Elementality. Each episode we will explore the challenges and the opportunities faced by financial advisors and how advisors can use elements to grow their business and serve their clients better. We hope you enjoy this episode.
Abby Morton:
Welcome to The Elementality Podcast everyone. I’m your host today, Abby Morton here with Grant Botma. Hello Grant, welcome to the show.
Grant Botma:
Hi, thanks for having me on. I’m excited.
Abby Morton:
I’m so excited. So, I met Grant actually at our customer workshop back in March. It’s not every day you get to meet advisors face to face, maybe a little bit with events back happening again, but Grant came to our workshop. I think he was pleasantly surprised at what he found there. So, quick shout out to the workshop. But as…
[chuckle]
Grant Botma:
Oh, I am… Look, I’ll interrupt you now. This is like, if you are listening to this podcast and you haven’t gone to one of those workshops, absolutely go. Not only were me and Jake thoroughly impressed with what we received while we were there and the value and the relationships, but we’re gonna go back and do it again and we’re gonna bring another one of our employees.
Abby Morton:
We love it. Well, yes, and you are invited all the time. We do have a great time together. It’s a small intimate group. We’re not looking to host 100, 200 person events because we want to really add value and really get to know you guys as advisors and what your challenges are. So, that’s the quick aside on the workshop, but as I got to know Grant a little bit more and what he’s doing at Stewardship, I just was blown away at what he’s created and all the value that I think Grant can provide our listeners. And so, today I’m bringing Grant on to talk about one specific topic, which is another marketing power up. Something that I think all advisor practices could definitely create, which is, it goes by a number of different names, but we can call it your ideal customer profile, your ideal customer avatar. There’s a number of different ways, but Grant says he’s created this in his firm and it has provided lots of value. So, why don’t you start, Grant, with giving us a quick introduction, what even is a customer avatar and… Just describe that so we all can get our bearings on what this even really means.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. I think all of us have a picture in our mind of clients that we love working with and actually love working with us. And then we also have a picture in our mind of clients that we don’t necessarily love working with, [chuckle] and maybe they don’t necessarily appreciate the services or products that we provide. And if you’re like most people, you may do more than picture those clients, but you might actually have a name.
[laughter]
Grant Botma:
And when you do, an ideal customer avatar or ideal customer profile, kind of workshopping, and have that for your business, it gives you a target. It helps you understand not only the types of marketing that you may want to engage in to attract more of those ideal customers, but it also helps you engineer customer journeys that those ideal customers will appreciate, and allows you to earn more referrals that are like those particular ideal customers. It gives you a target, it gives you something to aim at, and then as a result it gives so many important pieces of your business something to aim at as well.
Abby Morton:
I love it. It sounds like it not only helps you understand who you’re marketing to, but who you want to form your practice around. And it sounds like… And I’ve even looked at a couple of materials that Grant sent over to me in advance of this recording. I was blown away at how many different areas just this one thing can affect in your business. So talk us through, if I’m just starting out and I’m… Maybe I even have a specific niche, how do you go about creating that avatar for your business?
Grant Botma:
Most businesses will do demographic targeting, and I think that there’s value in doing that demographic targeting, but this ideal customer creation is different than that. In demographics, they talk about particular ages or parts of town or maybe even stages of life, sometimes even races or sexes. That’s not what this is. An ideal customer for us started with character traits. What are the character traits that we want to see in a particular customer? Because most advisors know that a lot of the work that we do is behavior management, where we’re helping them have the right behaviors and take the right actions with their finances so they can win. And folks who we enjoy working with do exhibit various character traits, and we know that we as a company wanna engage with our customers with certain character traits. You might even have some core values, and that’s where I think ideal customer creation starts. It’s what are the character traits of a client that you absolutely love working with? And if you’re stumped there, think to yourself, “What are the character traits you think make you as an advisor or you and your business valuable?” And that’s where it starts. It starts with their heart, it starts with their mind and the way that they think.
Abby Morton:
I like it. So do you mind sharing with our audience, it sounds like you’ve even labeled, you even mentioned this down to the name of the person who you’re targeting, would you mind sharing that with us? ‘Cause I think it’s a really interesting thing that you’ve done that’s very unique.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. So, when we’ve created our ideal customer, this is something that we review every year as owners and we add or remove things from our ideal customer. Sometimes we swing and miss with the way that we create this. And I want you to know if you’re listening to this and you’re gonna create your ideal customer, or maybe you’ve already done that, it’s okay to make adjustments to it. You’re the business owner. [chuckle] So, we make adjustments to ours as well. And when we started, we started with our four key character traits at Stewardship. We wanted our ideal customer to be transparent. We wanted our ideal customer to be humble. We want our ideal customer to be innovative, and we also want them to be loving. And when we think of those four character traits, we were talking to them, to our team and internally, about those character traits. And it just felt like it was hard to connect with ’cause you’re just repeating these character traits and repeating other things about the ideal customer.
Abby Morton:
They’re just words. It doesn’t necessarily feel like it sticks.
Grant Botma:
Yes. So we gave our ideal customer a persona. And at the time we were watching a TV show called Parks and Rec, and as we were thinking through the characters on the show Parks and Rec, our ideal customer who exhibited those character traits was Jerry, Jerry Gergich. [chuckle] And if you’ve watched that show before…
Abby Morton:
Shout out to Parks and Rec. If you haven’t, you gotta go watch it. ‘Cause Jerry is a great character on Parks and Rec.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. And he’s kind of an unsung hero, which is a little bit like our client. See, our client isn’t like Tom Haverford, who is the flashy one, who buys things maybe when he shouldn’t, or is showing off all the things that he purchases. He’s not that super flashy, glitzy guy. Our ideal customer isn’t Ron Swanson, who is the person that walks through his local Home Depot, and when a sales associate walks up to him and says, “Can I help you, sir?” And he responds with, “I know more than you.”
[laughter]
Grant Botma:
Our ideal customer is humble. Our ideal customer isn’t necessarily Leslie Knope, who is the unbelievably crazy detail-oriented person who has a three ring binder that is three inches thick with not only all of her questions, but all the things that she wants to do in this particular plan. Our ideal customer trusts us and they’re humble enough to trust us in that way. And that’s who Jerry is in the show. The guy, he lets people make fun of him, but he’s extremely kind and he’s extremely kind to everybody. He has an awesome life at home and he’s willing to submit other areas of his life to professionals or to trusted people so he can focus on what’s most important. And that is being the best husband and the best father he can be. And in the show they might make fun of that and they play some really good jokes, but it fit really well with the character traits and even the lifestyle that our ideal customer has.
Grant Botma:
So, when we’re coming across customers and we recognize like, “Oh, they really care about being an awesome parent. Oh wow, this person really wants to work on their marriage so much so that they’re willing to of let go of the investment management, and they don’t wanna DIY it and they trust somebody and stay in their lane. And they see that an advisor actually enhances their life so that they can focus on the things that matter to them most.” And when we see that and we see people who are like Jerry in that way, we say to ourselves internally, “Oh, there’s a Jerry right there.”
Abby Morton:
Yeah. No, I love it. What happens then when you have a customer come in who wants to work with you and they appear as a Ron Swanson or a Leslie Knope? How does that feel, and what do you do with that? It’s money. It’s money walking in the door. So what do you do?
Grant Botma:
Yes. That is an absolutely great question. One thing that we put at the top of every single one of our ideal customer worksheets is it says, “Ideal customer, not only customer.” It would be a dream if 100% of our clients were Jerrys. That would be amazing. And it’s also impossible.
[laughter]
Grant Botma:
It’s not gonna happen. And for most people, if 20% of their pipeline is filled with absolutely amazing ideal customers, wow, that’s a huge win. And for us, the more and more that we talk about Jerry, the more and more that we create marketing that Jerry would appreciate, the more and more that we create customer experiences that Jerry would appreciate, our ideal customer, the more Jerrys we end up getting. So it’s…
Abby Morton:
I like it.
Grant Botma:
It’s a big thing you have to know and understand, it’s ideal customer, not only customer. So how do we engage with people that come into our office that are not necessarily Jerry? Well, we exhibit the character traits we wanna see in Jerry. We are transparent to them, we’re humble to them. We’re innovative, we’re loving, we serve them, we serve them. Now it’s also wise to know and understand that when we’re engaging with a customer, we recognize, they’re not necessarily a Jerry. Well, then we know how maybe to serve them a little bit differently. We know areas that we should or maybe shouldn’t focus on. Maybe we are able to say to ourselves, “Ah, we might not wanna spend a ton of time asking for referrals from this particular person or earning referrals in that way from this person.” We might wanna spend more time with somebody over here, ’cause we want more people like them.
Abby Morton:
That’s very interesting. You actually answered that question differently than I thought. I thought you were gonna say, “Well, it’s just easy to say no because they’re not our ideal customer.” And I think that’s maybe where it depends practice to practice. If you’re creating a solo shop and you only wanna work with 80-100 clients, then maybe you are saying no because they don’t fit into that category. But I know at Stewardship it’s not a solo shop. You’re building something a little bigger. And so, like you’re saying, it affects you in other areas that you’re making for sure that you’re still accepting people and you’re helping them and you’re definitely factoring that into conversations that you’re having. But I think there’s a time and a place, and each person probably needs to decide what makes sense for them in their practice.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. Stewardship is not necessarily a “growth company” where we’re gonna go public and have offices all over the country. That’s not who we are. We’re a local company. And there’s two things that are very important to note with a local company. First thing is, your reputation can spread quickly. So, how you engage with clients, will spread locally throughout the other people in the community. So, even though somebody might not be an ideal client, well, we work with ideal clients, but they’re not our only clients. We work with other clients as well, and we just treat those folks the same. However, it is important to note that yes, as a local company, we’ve decided to ultimately limit our growth at some level, again, because we don’t wanna have offices all over the country, which means there is, ahead of time, a planned total number of clients that we are going to cap ourselves at.
Grant Botma:
And at some point, our goal is to fill that total number of clients with as many Jerrys as possible. Why? Because it’s a much more efficient business. We all know that 20% of our clients take 80% of our energy. What if we could flip that, where we’re working with mostly ideal customers who we appreciate and they appreciate us? Well, that will allow us to grow that client number higher and be a much more efficient business. So, yes, there will be a time where we’re going to say no to clients. And there’s even now times where we do say no to clients, and having the ideal customer does allow us to determine, “Is this a person that we need to consider saying no to?” But in the future, as our business continues to grow, it’ll be, we’ll be saying no a lot more often, we’ll be a lot more of an exclusive company. And how we determine how to be exclusive too, it points to our ideal customer avatar.
Abby Morton:
I like it. That makes sense. So, when you’re creating this avatar, it, it doesn’t sound like you’ve talked about, like you said, you left demographics out of it. You didn’t say much about how much money they’re making or their biggest goal is to sell their businesses for the the most money. Talk to me about why maybe those aren’t the things you want to focus on. And it sounds like you’re focusing more on being kind and humble and transparent. That wouldn’t initially be what I’d gravitate towards. And so talk to me about as I, as an advisor, I’m creating my own ICP, is another kind of acronym you’d hear around this, why those values you think are important and why I would go that direction rather than demographics.
Grant Botma:
Okay. Well, let me ask you this question. Let’s say you have an ICP and it is a 45-year old female who is a soccer mom with three kids that, two are in high school, one’s in junior high and she’s a stay-at-home mom, and the husband is a career person in the field of dentistry. And you get that specific with it, which many people do with their ICPs and there’s value to that. But then let’s say, a 85-year old widow walks in the door, who’s probably one of the kindest and wisest women you may have ever engaged with, she’s extremely sweet, generous, selfless. Oh, and by the way, she has a lot of assets. Who would you rather work with?
Grant Botma:
Yes, you have your ideal customer profile there, but really who you’re wanting to work with has more to do with the character of who they are and less about specifically what career they’re in or what they do in their free time. Are those things important to note? Yeah. And I think those things can be added to an ideal customer profile, but you have to start with the character traits. The truth is, we will work with any age, any gender, any person, but we absolutely love working with people who exhibit the character traits that we exhibit. Because then there’s a connection there that allows our business to be run a lot more efficiently. And for us, it started with our core values, loving, humble, transparent, and innovative. Those are the things we want. We want somebody who’s innovative because we don’t necessarily wanna work with a client where we suggest a particular product like maybe a structured note and they’re like, “Oh, what’s this? No”
Grant Botma:
And it’s absolutely the best for them. We want someone who’s gonna be able to listen to that and be wise and hear some of that advice. We want somebody who’s humble enough so that when we do maybe have to share with them some tough information, they’re willing to hear it and they say, “Yeah. You know what? I do need to change a little bit of my behaviors.” We want somebody who is going to be transparent. It’s hard to be a fiduciary for somebody unless you know them. The first rule of being a fiduciary is know the client. Well, in order for us to know the client, they’ve got to be transparent. And for us, our mission statement at Stewardship is we love people through finances. So we want our ideal customer to exhibit that love and in return to be loving. And those are the things that we look for and they’re very important to us.
Abby Morton:
Well, I think that’s so important, you putting it in that context, because as I’m thinking back to working with clients frequently, a lot of what you’re talking about is this emotional need and these emotional asks that you’re having to do. It doesn’t always come down to the numbers and communicating and emailing and conversing with these clients on a day to… Not day to day, but on a frequent basis. That’s why those values are so important, is because that’s really what ultimately leads those conversations and makes you enjoy or maybe not enjoy the person because of what they’re exuding. So I like that.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. And Abby, here’s the thing. Most people are awesome when things are going well. If you are client, you’re… The market’s up and you’re making them a lot of money and there’s a lot of green arrows when they log into their Betterment or TD or Charles Schwab or whatever, they’re gonna be happy, right?
Abby Morton:
Yeah.
Grant Botma:
But how are things when there’s the red arrows? How are things when there’s adversity in their life. And when we work with our ideal customers who have great character traits, it’s a lot easier to work with those folks. And not only a lot easier to work with those folks, but we’re allowed to find opportunities for those folks in down markets, which then help us in helping them with their wealth building journey. And we wanna put these character traits up front to make sure that we’re going to work with clients that are better to work with when times are tough. But, look, it’s more than character traits. I think you start there, but you also do have to engage in other pieces like understanding how many… How much they have in assets, in investible assets, maybe even understanding what their income is. One of the things that we talk a lot about is actually a mortgage or real estate term called debt to income ratio. Because clients that have margin, a bigger difference between how much money they make and how much money they’re spending, those things are really important too. So, yes, let’s start with the character traits, but yeah, we do wanna talk about economics as well.
Abby Morton:
Great. That’s awesome. So you sent me a piece of document in advance, and you don’t know, I’m gonna ask you this question, but I had to pause here ’cause I thought it was really great. The title of the slide is “Steps to Create Great Content.” And I think that this is really important and relates exactly to what we’re talking about today. And I think this is a huge struggle for lots of advisors, is creating this content flywheel and knowing what to post and what to say. As I read through these stepping stones, for lack of a better word, at the bottom it says, “This is for Jerry.” And it’s all linking back to your ideal customer, which is Jerry as we’ve talked about today. So talk me through knowing Jerry and understanding who he is, how that creates better content, and maybe give me some real tactical things that I can take away and learn from having my ICP.
Grant Botma:
So, we are a financial services firm, We are not a content creation place. As a result, we are not going to get a crazy crap ton of subscribers or likes or comments ’cause we’re not paid by having subscribers, likes, or comments. That’s not for us. And too often, business owners, small business owners and advisors can get caught up in that game.
Abby Morton:
I’ve never heard that perspective, but I really like it. I think that’s a fair point to think about.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. I’m not gonna compete with Mr. Beast or Dude Perfect on YouTube. That’s not what I [laughter] created our YouTube channel for. I created our YouTube and our videos for Jerry. And it can be discouraging if you create a piece of content and then all of a sudden it doesn’t get the engagement that you were hoping it would get. But you gotta remember your target, “My target is Jerry, my target is an engagement. I’m a financial services firm, not a content creation firm. I’m not getting paid ad dollars based on the engagement of the content I produce.” And what we know about our ideal customer is, on social media he’s a lurker. He goes to social media, he opens the app, but he very rarely clicks on something or comments on it.
[laughter]
Abby Morton:
I love this.
Grant Botma:
He absolutely sees what I create. He lurks out there. That’s what Jerry does, but he doesn’t necessarily engage with it. So even though I might produce a piece of content that got three comments and 10 likes, and I think, “Oh man, that was a failure,” it wasn’t. Because a month later I might run into somebody at church and they say, “Hey, I saw that video that you posted, blah, blah blah, that was so great.” And in my head I’m like, “You saw that?” They are a Jerry, and they’re a lurker, and they were on social media, they saw the post, they watched the video, they read the blog, they listened to the podcast or whatever it was. And they thought, “Wow, that was valuable.” It literally happened to me yesterday. We had… A husband and wife came into the office, I had never met them before, so they stopped me in the lobby like, “Oh, hey, you’re Grant.” And I’m like, “Yeah.” And just shook their hands, and we made a connection based on how they became clients and how they knew of me and how I knew of them. And they were talking about a podcast episode that we recorded several months ago. And I know the data on this podcast episode is extremely low. The total number of downloads that I get to see in the backend was not good.
[chuckle]
Grant Botma:
But they listened to it and they enjoyed it. And so much so that they shared it with other people and it helped them become clients. So the reason why we’re able to experience a win in earning clients, which is what we do with our content, is because we are creating content that we know our ideal customers appreciate. And when you create content that your ideal customers appreciate, it also helps you filter out clients that you may not want. So, for us clients that are constantly trying to DIY their finances is tough. So, in our content, we talk a lot about trusting an advisor, staying in your lane and focusing on what you are good at, which is nobody can be the parent or the the spouse or the career person you are. And some people might hear that and listen to it and be like, “Oh, that might turn some people off.” And it does, but it turns off the person that’s not our ideal client. It doesn’t mean they’re a bad person. [chuckle] It doesn’t mean we don’t like them. It just means that we’re not set up to maybe serve them in the best way possible. And here’s the thing, Abby, too often we can get our feelings hurt if somebody doesn’t wanna work with us or we shouldn’t be working with somebody else.
Grant Botma:
Exclusivity is a good thing. I have an exclusive relationship with my wife. That’s good. [chuckle] Exclusivity isn’t bad. [chuckle] But also it would take extreme hubris for me to think that the business I’ve created anybody and everybody absolutely should be working with me and nobody else should work with anybody else. That’s a lot of pride. And the ideal customer avatar process in creating not only the character traits, but maybe some economic traits, and maybe some reactions of how an a ideal person responds to things, wow, that helps us determine who we wanna target in our marketing.
Abby Morton:
Love it. Like that… Amazing. [laughter] I don’t know if I could add anything else to that. So we’re about out of time, I’m just thinking one thing you said at the beginning was you update this every year, so just because you created Jerry today, doesn’t necessarily mean Jerry’s gonna be the same forever. So, talk to me a little bit about, is it important to come back and look at it every year? What benefits have you seen in actually doing that for yourself?
Grant Botma:
Oh, man. It’s absolutely important to look back at it every year. I get a lot of things wrong, a lot. [chuckle] And evaluating things every year, Abby, allows us to determine where we got things wrong and how we can adjust them moving forward. We’re gonna constantly make adjustments. We exhibit the character traits we talk about, we’re gonna be innovative and humble too. So on an annual basis, I get together with my business partners and we go on what’s called a founder’s retreat, where we leave the office, we even leave town, and we look back at the year that was, we talk about the year ahead and we create goals and we look at where we won, where we’ve lost and make adjustments. And one area that we look at is our ideal customer.
Grant Botma:
We ask ourselves four questions. What do we wanna do more of? What do we wanna do less of? What do we wanna add, and what do we want to remove? And we ask those four questions as it pertains to Jerry, what do we wanna add to Jerry? We try to just pick one thing. What do we wanna remove from Jerry? What do we want to see more of on Jerry? And what do we want to see less of on Jerry? Those four questions help us evaluate what was going well with Jerry and how we want to adjust it moving forward. And I’ll share with you, we actually just got back from our annual founders retreat a couple weeks ago. We do this in the middle of the summer because the end of the year is the end of the year, it’s so crazy. So, we make things happening in the summer, and one of the things that we looked back at with Jerry is some of the economic traits, and we’re making adjustments to the economic traits that we have for our ideal customer.
Grant Botma:
And we’re now breaking things up into three stages of wealth building. We’ve identified what we call three stages of wealth building. We’ve made YouTube videos about it and blogs about it. And now we’re going to connect the stages of wealth building that we’ve defined and created, and we’re going to connect those with Jerry. And now moving forward, our team is gonna talk about Jerry and the character traits, and then what stage of wealth Jerry is in. And then we’re gonna connect Jerry with the proper financial products and services that we offer, to help Jerry move along in that stage of wealth building process. So not only can we celebrate Jerry, but we can celebrate internally as well. It’s gonna make loving people through finances a lot more fun.
Abby Morton:
I love it. I love it. All right, any final words for our listeners today from you?
Grant Botma:
I’ll start how I ended. Abby, thank you so much for having me on, giving me an opportunity to share with advisors. This ideal customer avatar thing is really great. And we got it wrong when we first started, but we started. So if you haven’t done this yet, I just want to encourage you start. Start somewhere and then every year make adjustments to it. That’s totally okay. Jerry has evolved a lot, he wasn’t even called Jerry at the beginning. [laughter] And it’s been an awesome thing for us. And again, as I started before, me and Abby met at the Element’s Workshop in Salt Lake City, was that where it was, Salt Lake, right?
Abby Morton:
It was. Yep.
Grant Botma:
Yeah. I strongly suggest that you guys sign up for that Element’s Workshop. As she said, it was a small, intimate environment, at a really cool place that had very good coffee. And it gave me the opportunity to shake hands with some really great people, talk about areas where we were winning and we were losing. And me and my business partner walked out of there with some amazing ideas and some stuff that we’re gonna be launching new in our practice this year, just from that workshop. And we’re pumped up and excited about it. So, if you’re listening and you haven’t been to Salt Lake yet, sign up, check it out, go do it. You’ll enjoy it.
Abby Morton:
Thanks Grant. I should just have you on every day. We could talk all day about these amazing things. So, thanks again for your time. I appreciate it. If people do wanna reach out and ask you questions, do you mind, number one? And number two, where can they find you if you’re okay with it?
Grant Botma:
Absolutely happy to help. If you got questions about ideal customer avatar, you wanna see our ideal customer avatar worksheet, you just let me know. I am @grantbotma on almost every social media platform. I post all the time on Instagram. I actually do some reels and stuff about the elements, free financial assessment stuff that we’ve been doing, and you can see some of that. But, yeah, you can hit me up on DMs, on Instagram, on Twitter, all the social media platforms @grantbotma, and send me a DM, and I’ll be happy to chat with you.
Abby Morton:
Awesome. He’s a great connection to have, so go and make the connection. Thanks again, Grant. Appreciate your time.
Grant Botma:
Awesome. Happy to help. Thanks Abby.
Abby Morton:
Next time on Elementality.
[music]
David DeCelle:
Good habits create good habits, so we’re trying to create those good habits on the onset, so that the other things that we bring up on a go forward basis get integrated and you stay consistent with it. Because it doesn’t matter what referral methodology you subscribe to, if you don’t do it consistently, you’re not going to get results. If you do it for a month or two and you’re like, “Oh, it’s not working,” and then you immediately switch, you never give it time to mature and bear that fruit on the backend. So what we’re trying to teach is making sure that you are someone that can call themselves consistent, so that when you choose to implement something, you’re consistent with that implementation and you give yourself enough time to reap the rewards on the backend.
Abby Morton:
To find out more about Elements, go to getelements.com/demo. Elementality’s executive producers are Reese Harper and Carl Richards. Elementality is produced by Tad Henderson and directed by Abby Morton. Have a good one.